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I have an idea that when the Insect Civilization was defeated, humans went to their home planet and exploited various life forms there. There would only have been one sentient species as with our own planet but plenty of other species which could have been exploited.
A species of large dragon-fly like creature was bred and eventually one of its descendents was the Lexx. The sentient insect bodies were not bred because that would have been too dangerous even thought they had their consciousness removed. Other species would have become Stingers etc.
Rockham.
Here’s my speculation on the Insect caste system and the origin of the Lexx:
Now, it is plausible that the Insect civilization consisted of a number of castes specialized for different jobs within the society. It is even possible that the essences of a single Insect could reside in more than one body based on the task at hand. On Earth, I believe insect hives can have as many as 6 different castes. Now, my theory is that the genetic code for all the castes resides in the D.N.A. of each and every Insect, like all the junk D.N.A. we have that codes for traits our ancestors discarded millions of years ago. All of this is in each larva, they are stimulated to grow into a certain type but the D.N.A. remains. Now, this would also mean that if you had a sample of the D.N.A. of any Insect, or possibly even Insect-based constructs, you would have the genetic material to create any caste, or even a new type of organism with different characteristics of different castes that do not normally exist together in one being. In other words, with just a tissue sample from the Giga Shadow or a stinger you could grow things as dimorphous as moths and the Lexx.
Now, if the caste theory is correct and if the synthetic constructs used are based directly on a single caste, then we can assign Insect(oid)s we’ve seen to a certain caste. Stingers would be warriors (well, duh) and moths would be workers. The Lexx’s nature is less clear. It is bigger than most craft, which would imply a royal caste. But size may not matter, since the builders of Insect craft could suppress growth so their ships didn’t get so big it required major resources to keep them alive. The Lexx has been identified as male, which would imply that it is based on a male/king/drone. In insect societies on Earth all of the non-royal castes are infertile females. But Insects may not be the same as insects. Now, warrior is also implied, by the fact that the Lexx can blow up planets. Maybe there are different subcastes of warriors, common “light” warriors like stingers and “heavy” warriors like the Lexx that have a special limited function, like to protect the queen. Now, what was the Giga Shadow? It had a bunch of larvae attached to it, so that would imply that it was a queen. But that was at the end of its life. In Earth insects, sometimes a normally infertile worker can develop into a queen if the colony’s queen has died. So the Giga Shadow would’ve been a pseudo-queen or quasi-queen, something different earlier in its life. I find it most likely that the last surviving Insect was just a minor work unit, something relatively insignificant to the Insect civilization and the human forces that exterminated them. Queens would’ve been the first priority for things to destroy. But if the Shadow (the young Giga Shadow) was a worker, we run into problems since we (I) have already assigned moths to the worker caste. But perhaps moths were a specific subcaste employed for work requiring long-range travel, so they would be “scouts” instead of plain “workers.” All of this is speculative, the idea of a caste hierarchy itself is merely theoretical.
We don’t know if the craft like moths, stingers, and the Lexx were even based directly on a specific type of Insect. Their D.N.A. could have active parts from several different castes. Moths seem to be grown by grafting a number of tissues onto a metal frame. The different tissues may come from different castes and have different genetic codes.
I like your ideas DT, but I’d have to disagree with your caste theroy. From what I understand caste implies that the creatures are from the smae species. I doubt that the Stingers, and Giga Shadow insects(hereafter refered to as pill bugs), LEXX and moths are of the same species. Same order maybe, but not species. I think of the insect civilization as a confederacy of different insects (assuming it wasn’t just the pill bugs) fighting against the humans. The pill bugs were huge creatures and very intelligent. They were the “brain” bugs and also heavy warriers. Whereas stingers (If they weren’t just a Brunnen G or other human creation) were light warriers. We haven’t seen any other natural bugs so its hard to tell what oany ther speices jobs were; if there was any other speices. We haven’t heard any back story on the insect war so its hard to tell if anything besides the pill bugs fought or existed.
The LEXX and moths (and possibly stigners) are human creations, so they do not fit into an insect society. But I agree you that they came from insect DNA.Correction, we did see the web/net creature. I have no idea what roll it/could’ve played in the insect war. Perhaps just another fighter. Since it still existed, and the Brunnen G thought it destroyed all the insects, perhaps they only referd to the pill bugs. The stigners seem content to do what they’re told (hence why I think they’re a human creation), but the web/net creature just wants to catch food and survive. The pill bugs were intent on destroying all human life, so they may have incited/recruited the other bugs to fight the humans. Once the Brunnen G destoryed the pill bugs, with no unifying force, the other insects scattered and went back to being typical survivalistic creatures. Much like the insects that live on our own world.
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Originally posted by Headgehog:
Correction, we did see the web/net creature. I have no idea what roll it/could’ve played in the insect war. Perhaps just another fighter. Since it still existed, and the Brunnen G thought it destroyed all the insects, perhaps they only referd to the pill bugs. The stigners seem content to do what they’re told (hence why I think they’re a human creation), but the web/net creature just wants to catch food and survive. The pill bugs were intent on destroying all human life, so they may have incited/recruited the other bugs to fight the humans. Once the Brunnen G destoryed the pill bugs, with no unifying force, the other insects scattered and went back to being typical survivalistic creatures. Much like the insects that live on our own world.
I do not believe the Net in the episodes The Net and The Web was an Insect (just to clarify my half-sane semantics, Nets are the species, Webs and Spiders are the components). I think it was a completely different species. The Net body plan was radially symmetrical, based on 8. The Insect body plan seems to be based on 3 and 7 and always bilateral. It does have similar characteristics, like an exoskeleton, enormous size, the capability of interstellar travel, and the ability to pass part of its intelligence to hosts of other species. So it’s possible that the Nets originally came from the same planet as the Insects, that they share the same evolutionary ancestry and may belong to the same phylum. Or this could all be the result of convergent evolution and the Nets and Insects could have arisen in different star systems entirely. Now, Insects could not have existed in vacuum (speaking metaphorically, of course). They must have been part of an ecosystem, with standard prey to sustain them and predators to keep them in check. The Nets may have been just such a predator. The Lexx is programmed to be afraid of the Web he sees. He also knows that where there’s a Web there’s likely to be a Spider. His instincts told him to turn but Stan told him not to, with disastrous results. This implies that the Insects and the Nets had previous contact, and, as with this situation, the Insect was the victim.
The caste theory is just that, a theory. There isn’t really enough data about the Insect civilization to tell how closely that speculation adheres to “reality.” But, keep in mind, terrestrial insects can show considerable polymorphism within one species, and the Insects had advanced technology like genetic engineering which they could have used to greater specialize and differentiate castes. Also, even if there was only one caste, the genetic engineering and tissue manipulation of later groups like the Brunnen-G and the League of 20,000 Planets could account for all the differences.
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Originally posted by DalekTek790:
I do not believe the Net in the episodes The Net and The Web was an Insect (just to clarify my half-sane semantics, Nets are the species, Webs and Spiders are the components). I think it was a completely different species. The Net body plan was radially symmetrical, based on 8. The Insect body plan seems to be based on 3 and 7 and always bilateral. It does have similar characteristics, like an exoskeleton, enormous size, the capability of interstellar travel, and the ability to pass part of its intelligence to hosts of other species.
The Lexx is programmed to be afraid of the Web he sees. He also knows that where there’s a Web there’s likely to be a Spider. His instincts told him to turn but Stan told him not to, with disastrous results. This implies that the Insects and the Nets had previous contact, and, as with this situation, the Insect was the victim.
But, keep in mind, terrestrial insects can show considerable polymorphism within one species, and the Insects had advanced technology like genetic engineering which they could have used to greater specialize and differentiate castes.
I was basing my assumptions that the nets were insects based on theire size, intelligence…
You made a good point witht the 3 and 7 segments. Yes I know that is the case but I (and 99.9% of the population) tend to group bugs,insects,aracnids etc in the same group: Creepy crawly things I don’t want touching me or my food or living in my house!I wouldn’t say that the LEXX is programmed like a computer to be afraid of webs. That fear is natural to him. Much like how LEXX moths and terrestial moths are drawn to flame. And how every other lifeform (except for us) on the planet stays away from things with bright colors. i.e. bees, poison dart frogs, monarch butterflies etc. Bright colors are natures way of saying don’t touch. We make our bombs that way too. Unfortuanlty bright colors attract children, d’oh.
I’ve read about/seen ants with huge variantions within a species. Ranging from size, color, mandibles etc. But each one still looks like another ant. A moth, a dragon fly and a pill bug look nothing alike. That’s why I disagree witht the caste theory. Individual castes within the pill bugs isn’t such a bad idea though, too bad we’ll never get any back story to prove it one way or another.
It’s probably been brought up before, but my impression of the origin of the Lexx is rather simple. At the beginning of IWHS, His Shadow killed Kai and then picked up a piece of his bug-spaceship stating, “An insect. Curious…” (Or something like that.) I took this as foreshadowing. It seemed pretty clear to me that His Shadow took the pieces of Kai’s bug-ship, studied it’s biomechanical technology, and eventually built the Lexx. Keep in mind that when they made Tales From A Parallel Universe, it may have been just a “one-shot”, a movie with no real plans for a sequel. I think that after a couple of movies were made, they decided to tie in the insect civilization and His Shadow.
But I could be wrong, ya know. I haven’t read up on the subject in articles or interviews.
Ive always gone with what the plot says.
Lexx plans were based from the Astral B, stored in Stans tooth. Probably the Heretics couldent build it.
However Brizon could, and did. Thus the Lexx was born.
How did the Heretics get that knowledge? Id have to guess that shortly before the Brunnin G were destroyed we learn they contacted the outside world(Brigadoom). But about what? This could be part of it, maybe they downloaded their knowledge to the heretics.
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Originally posted by Headgehog:
You made a good point witht the 3 and 7 segments. Yes I know that is the case but I (and 99.9% of the population) tend to group bugs,insects,aracnids etc in the same group: Creepy crawly things I don’t want touching me or my food or living in my house!
That may be true (though I’d think more like 60%), but I think it’s pretty safe to say the Supreme Beans and the Lexx writing staff know much more about entomology (and science as a whole) than I do, and were applying that knowledge when creating the Insects.
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I was basing my assumptions that the nets were insects based on theire size, intelligence…
I think it’s likely they’re related, but I would think the Nets to be a group separate from, not to mention hostile to, the Insects.
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I wouldn’t say that the LEXX is programmed like a computer to be afraid of webs. That fear is natural to him. Much like how LEXX moths and terrestial moths are drawn to flame. And how every other lifeform (except for us) on the planet stays away from things with bright colors. i.e. bees, poison dart frogs, monarch butterflies etc. Bright colors are natures way of saying don’t touch. We make our bombs that way too. Unfortuanlty bright colors attract children, d’oh.
I don’t know if the Lexx’s thoughts and impulses are the result of computer-like programming, Insect instincts, or some combination of both. But regardless, some aspect of its mind made it want to turn away from the Net. This implies that the Insects were afraid of the Nets, and knew that some may still lurk in the Light Zone looking for Insect prey. The Lexx also seems familiar with the biology of the Nets (“where there is a Web, there could be a Spider!”). And (this isn’t really relevent) that second part isn’t exactly true. Hummingbirds are instinctively attracted to the colors yellow and red (an impulse that does not always work to their advantage).
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I’ve read about/seen ants with huge variantions within a species. Ranging from size, color, mandibles etc. But each one still looks like another ant. A moth, a dragon fly and a pill bug look nothing alike. That’s why I disagree witht the caste theory. Individual castes within the pill bugs isn’t such a bad idea though, too bad we’ll never get any back story to prove it one way or another.
Actually, pill bugs don’t have castes. They’re isopods, not insects (and I know I referred to them as uropods in a previous post, if you’re going to point that out; that was erroneous). I don’t think we’ve heard the last of the back story of the Insect civilization. There are still several more episodes for Insect reappearances and explanatory dialog, plus the possibility of a spinoff and future movies. Besides, I think the Beans devised all of the information about the Insect civilization that has been revealed and much more before they started writing the Lexx movies, and are just revealing it to viewere on a need to know basis (much like Chris Carter with the X-Files conspiracy and J. Michael Straczynski with the multilayered story arcs of Babylon 5). I think somewhere, someone has the answer to all our questions.
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Originally posted by LexxLurker:
Ive always gone with what the plot says.Lexx plans were based from the Astral B, stored in Stans tooth. Probably the Heretics couldent build it.
However Brizon could, and did. Thus the Lexx was born.
How did the Heretics get that knowledge? Id have to guess that shortly before the Brunnin G were destroyed we learn they contacted the outside world(Brigadoom). But about what? This could be part of it, maybe they downloaded their knowledge to the heretics.
This is only one possibility, but I think the ability to create creature-machines like the Lexx and the moths was part of the knowledge the Insect inside the Cluster gave His Divine Shadow when he passed his essence to a human host. His Shadow gave a select group of bio-viziers this Insect arcana, and they used either the D.N.A. from Kai’s crashed stinger or secret samples extracted from the Cluster insect itself (or both) to bring these plans to fruition.
It is important to remember that, though Brizon said he built the Lexx, he is an ego-centric braggard with a tendancy to take credit for other peoples’ accomplishments. He may have really been the major force behind the Lexx’s creation, or he may have simply been one of dozens (or even hundreds) of brilliant minds who made the Lexx possible.
Yeah I should’ve mentioned that. In Brizon, Brizon lies quite a bit. If you listen carefully Mantrid later claims after Brizon is dead that Brizon did not invent the machine that is Mantrid. Just something else that Brizon lied about since Mantrid really had no reason to lie at that point. Most likely Brizon like a few top scientists had a great student like Mantrid doing their work.
Brizon would’ve had considerable insect technology at his disposal, indicated by the fact that he still had Kais craft after 2000 years. So Ive always just assumed the above unless anything new is explained this series.
To a large extent, I agree with LexxLurker.
We know the plans from the Lexx were stolen from the Ostral-B Heretics, via amino acid codes found in the tooth of one of their assistant deputy backup couriers.
We also know that Kai’s Insect Craft reminded HDS of an Insect (or even fooled him into thinking it was an Insect).
We also know that the tiny Insect Craft were relics of the Great Insect War; the war between the Insect Civilization and all human kind.
We also know the Brunnen-G were not just great engineers, they were great BIO-engineers. They were able to alter their own innermost cell structure to halt their aging process.
We also know the Ostral-B Heretics are aware of the Brunnen-G culture, and have full knowledge of the Time Prophet’s prophecy regarding them.
Note also that the Brunnen-G and the Ostral-B have a few interesting things in common:
1. Both engineered bug-like ships.
2. Both built impenetrable planetary shields.
3. Both civilizations end with a dash-letter.My theory is similar to Lexx Lurker’s:
The Insect Craft were the Brunnen-G’s bio-engineered invention, their secret weapon, and their key to victory against the Insect Civilization: The craft are intended to be mistaken for Insects. This could make them difficult for actual Insects to perceive as enemies, attack, or target with weapons. While six Insect Craft don’t amount to much, it is likely they used swarm tactics, similar to Mantrid Drones, to attack and kill Insects.
Jump ahead a few thousand years to the attack on Brunnis 2. The Foreshadow bombards the planet and basically wipes everybody out… but the planet isn’t exactly obliterated. The surface is probably a wreck, but the planet itself looks fairly intact.
Somehow, the Ostral-B Heretics learn about the Brunnen-G and the prophecy. My own pet (conjectural) theory is that one of the officers on the Foreshadow was Ostral-B, that he witnessed the conversation between Kai and HDS, and that he was impressed by the bravery of the Brunnen-G. Maybe they visit the Time Prophet, and then maybe they explore the rubble of Brunnis 2.
The Heretics learn two important things from the knowledge they salvage from the Brunnen-G:
1. How to bio-engineer insect-based craft.
2. How to engineer powerful defensive shields to protect their planets.
Taking their example from Kai’s desperate battle, the Ostral-B join with other Heretics, and establish the Reform Planets, with shields protecting them from the Divine Order. They begin developing plans for the Lexx. Since such a design is a large undertaking, the project required cooperative research between scientists on different Reform Planets. Hence, couriers take data back and forth, and also carry codes to pass the shields.
One of these couriers gets captured alive, and the rest is history.
A bit more speculation: perhaps the Lexx’s weapon is nothing more than a forward-projecting laterally-oriented planetary shield! It does seem to “slice” through a planet (at least until Season 4
). Thoughts?
A great culmination os suppositiions!
I agree that the Ostrel-B did design the Lexx although Brizon saying it was his creation, ws probably the interior decoration (cluster symbol bridge) and beefing up the weapons. If you notice it keeps changing the way it looks and fires. The caste isea is good because the Lexx can grow moths which are a different race, the Lexx was probably designed from an old insect. Although the part about using the stingers, the Brunnen-g did domesticate insects for the purpases of technology so they may be captured insects from the standerd metalic technology, genetically modified to be enslaved by the Brunnen-G to serve as a more powerfull weapon that can confuse insects. Although the insects are a remenent of the insect war then why does Brizon have one, and why would it have a longer range than insects. BTW the insects may have been smart, but Kai said they were methodical and predictable. I think that the usage of insect technology happenned part way through the way and thereafter.
Maybe the insect war will be the topic of the spin-off?
Quick correction
Although the insects are a remenent of the insect war then why does Brizon have one, and why would it have a longer range than insects
Should be……
Although the stingers are a remenent of the insect war then why does Brizon have one, and why would it have a longer range than Moths
Pill bugs are isopods which are a type of crustacean. Scientists now believe that insects evolved from crustaceans. There is another creature which is like a pill bug and may even be called a pill bug and that is the pill millipede. Millipedes and insects are in a group called uniramians.
The pill bug form is something that evolved in nature more than once and so we would expect it to evolve on other planets too. There were creatures with this form in the Dr Who story The Zarbi.
The Insects seem to be able to grow to enormous size. They also seem to be able to survive the vacuum of space. Perhaps their planet did not have an atmosphere. I would suggest that the ability to destroy planets was a technology added to Lexx and not part of its biology.
Rockham.
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Originally posted by Rockham:
The pill bug form is something that evolved in nature more than once and so we would expect it to evolve on other planets too. There were creatures with this form in the Dr Who story The Zarbi.
Zaaaar-beee! Eee! Eee! Eee! Eee! Eee!
[ 04-03-2002: Message edited by: DalekTek790 ]
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Originally posted by Rockham:
The Insects seem to be able to grow to enormous size. They also seem to be able to survive the vacuum of space. Perhaps their planet did not have an atmosphere. I would suggest that the ability to destroy planets was a technology added to Lexx and not part of its biology.Rockham.
Yeap. Thats what I’ve always assumed too. The “Dragonfly” parabolas create and release some type of energy which the machine then focuses and releases. At least thats what I’ve assumed
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Originally posted by Flamegrape:
Those things look cute! But let me guess… they shoot death-rays from their eyes, right? LOL!
It’s a larvae gun (also called a venom grub), one of the large insect fauna of vortis enslaved by the Animus. They spit acid. The episode is generally called The Web Planet, The Zarbi is an alternate title used for the novelization.
Creatures like ants and termites (and pill bugs) have evolved more than once on earth and so we would expect them to evolve also on other planets. Humans however evolved only once and may not be very numerous.
I predict that when humans explore other planets for every one planet that has evolved a humanoid life form there will be 1,000 that have evolved an ant/termite like life form.
This could be very disappointing for explorers but their cities could be of use to us because they could provide shelter from a hostile environment.
Rockham.
While your stock Insect Civilization insect can’t shoot the same way the Lexx shoots, it probably CAN shoot “sheets of pure energy” similar to the Foreshadow and the hand weapons routinely seen in the light universe.
Why?
Because HDS had the power to emanate these “sheets of pure energy” directly out of his body. This surely must be derived from the Insect essence within him, and therefore be an inherent capability of the Insects themselves.
Why didn’t we see the Giga Shadow shoot these sheets?
Maybe because it was “prematurely reborn” and not fully awake before it got sucked into the fractal core.
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Originally posted by Sgt. Draino:
Why didn’t we see the Giga Shadow shoot these sheets?Maybe because it was “prematurely reborn” and not fully awake before it got sucked into the fractal core.
The Giga Shadow did fire internal blacksheets try to destroy Kai. I agree, Insects probably have a “black organ” (equivalent to the Divine personal guards’ blackpacks), but in the Giga Shadow it was not fully functional by the time the body was destroyed.
The blacksheet guns and the Fore Shadow were probably mechanical systems designed after the Insect structure (in whatever physical or semicorporeal form it may exist) that generates its own blacksheets. But the artificial blacksheets can’t be as powerful as the real thing. Why? None of the blacksheets fired from guns can hurt Kai, but the ones His Shadow produced in I Worship His Shadow and The Giga Shadow were clearly damaging him and would have destroyed him with further onslaught (His Shadow was no idiot, he let the bio-viziers create assassins invulnerable to conventional weapons, but they were always within his ability to destroy).
Note that there are at least two types of blacksheets from guns (some are bilateral, others spiral), and I think three designs of blacksheet guns. Blacksheet guns appear in I Worship His Shadow, The Giga Shadow, Stan’s Trial, and Woz.
I do not think the Lexx’s weapon is an Insect blacksheet system. It has ocular parabola, which seem to focus and redirect some kind of energy of external source, and are all in all entirely different from the systems of the Fore Shadow and the Insects themselves. Plus they can’t destroy Kai.
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