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i heard something on the radio a few days ago about the Mexican government admitting to the existence of ufo’s. does anyone know any more about this? apparently their airforce has chased about 11 objects recently. that’s all i know about it. i would have thought a bigger thing would have been made of it, but i suppose there’s so much going on in the world….nonetheless, i’d still like to know more about what’s going on!!!
(hello everyone, btw. crawled out from under a ton of Astronomy & Planetary science coursework. soz for not being around so often!!! 🙂 )Okay Ill tell you the facts then I’ll tell you my whacky theory.
What they did do, was take a recent tape of a UFO (Unidentified Flying Object) and gave it directly to a conspiricy nut, who immediately began phoning every media outlet that this was proof. Keep in mind a UFO is anything that has not been identified. There was a famous UFO case involving a man who lept from an airplane 😳
But just like all the other cases before all you can see on the tape is a bunch of blurry lights.
However. This has been going on for as long as we’ve had airplanes. As far back as World War I, pilots have reported seeing bright blue lights flying around. All the pilots stories are fairly much the same.
This tells me it’s true. But what is it? And why do only people in Planes see them? And why does almost every single report say that the objects fled when sighted? Sounds a bit like an organism to me, or a mirage.
Personally I think it’s some trick of the light in the atmosphere. But a far reaching theory could be: How much do we know about life on Earth? How do we know there isn’t any organisms that survive in the upper atmosphere? We have creatures who can survive incredible pressures and almost no oxygen underwater, so why not in the air?
Personally I think they could be the mythical “Will-O-Whisps” or just a trick of the light. But it’s undeniable they exist whatever it is.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/space/05/17/mexico.ufos.reut/index.html
Sorry I cannot find the original article =(
They’re back! I knew they didn’t mean to leave me behind!
…Darn.
Anyway…
I think that humans are arrogant for thinking that they are the only sentient species in the universe…but then again…maybe UFO’s’re just birds who flew too close to nuclear test sites.
Who knows?
TranceGemini613 wrote:I think that humans are arrogant for thinking that they are the only sentient species in the universe
You said it Brother. But I have to wonder what we refer to Sentience as, as being awfully egocentric as well =) We base our form of sentience as the benchmark for perception of reality when we ourselves only experience three layers of reality, compared to the minimum of 9 we know to exist 😉
But now I’m getting awfully geeky!
Well, I was generally referring to the benchmark set by humans as this is the only way we have to gauge sentience. If we were to interact with another species, we could change our definitions. We are limited by what we know (and know to find…) and cannot think outside of our box with no perception of HOW outside thinking is to be done.
Now I’m getting geeky AND grammatically correct.
TranceGemini613 wrote:…Now I’m getting geeky AND grammatically correct.
Much as I’d like to add something intelligent to the discussion, it’s all Geek to me. 😉 Welcome aboard, Trance, and welcome back Snooklepie.
Incidentally, it must be something in the air, UFO fever has swept Iran.
No government has denied the existence of UFOs, they’ve just denied the theory that they are alien spacecraft. Merely being unidentified doesn’t make something otherworldly.
Personally, I think it’s haughty to believe Earth has the only life in creation, or that carbon-based life is the only possible kind, but I don’t believe for a minute we have any flying saucers (or equivalent) visiting us. Wouldn’t they have better things to do than come down here and do donuts in a cornfield?
Also, it seems the fever has died down in the US since digital cameras have become available on the general market.
Then again, I apologise to my trees and give the woods some whisky when I cut their errant limbs off, I always say “Hello” to crows, fast on medieval holidays and believe I share part of my soul with my sweet l’il orange cat, so really you shouldn’t listen to me when I argue against someone else’s beliefs, if you know what I mean. 😉
No one believes the exact same thing as anyone else. If we did, we wouldn’t have anything to talk about. Mathematicians are still arguing about whether the probability of getting heads on a coin on the 100th toss is based on all the previous tosses or is just 50/50. It all depends on how you look at the evidence. I see tricks of light, no lifeforms. If other people see lifeforms, it doesn’t bother me any. To each his own. I remember when I was in High School many scientists didn’t believe ball lightning existed in spite of all the eyewitnesses until someone reproduced it in a lab (on a small scale with plasma, if I remember right).
But, I would like to add that I get out of work at about sunrise, and drive west past an airport. In the spring and fall we all see many glowing floating lights which disappear when we get closer, or rather, when the plane banks to the right or left and the sun no longer reflects off of it. They look exactly like some of the videos I’ve seen of sunrise and sunset UFO’s filmed from the ground.
Pet
Actually that didn’t come off too well, not the way I meant it anyway 😯
I’m more thinking of Julian Jaynes work, about how our bicameral minds may make us more of a mutation than any natural progression of intelligence in the Universe. And he provides very hard to defeat evidence from Gilgamesh, Homer and other early poets which clearly dictate an evolution in thinking from “You MUST obey the Gods!” to “Well, we can think for ourselves!”. Humans existed for possibly up to or over a million years before we created Sumer, and Ur, Uruk, Nippur and the rest of the bunch. So what changed so drastically in the last 7000 years? Anyways I’m getting into the books and essays now so…
More to the point, I’m just *very* personally intrigued by the option that we might be a very unique form of life in the way we think and shape reality. Certainly somewhere out there in the vastness of the Universe another race like ours exists. Possibly even the exact same evolutionary path. Religions aside, it’s very ignorant to think otherwise, unless we’re missing something so fundamental that there really isn’t a Universe filled with millions of Galaxies out there each containing hundreds of thousands of star systems which most have planetary bodies orbiting them. Out of those trillions of possibilities how can there not be?
However we have a planet filled with life, yet we can barely understand any of it. We cannot even trace our own origins back sufficiently enough to understand our own evolution. Do we gauge the intelligence of a creatures ability to build empires and languages? Or do we set aside all other lifeforms for the ones we consider most compatible with us, hence our word “Sentient”. Who’s the winner? The Dolphins who live full and healthy lives, or the humans who spend it warring? We still argue over the fact whether or not Dolphins have language.
I truly would not be surprised to find the Universe littered with life far beyond our comprehension and vice-versa. Even on Earth we have creatures who communicate by pheremones and receptors.
To use a Sci-Fi quote “If an ant were to ask another ant, “what was that?!?”, How could it answer?” Two of my other favorite fictions “Star Control” and “Enders Game” deal with the problem of true Xenophobia and incompatibility. I loved the way the Insect at the end claims that God must exist, because who else could play a joke so cruel that two species who have so much in common be so different in their way of perceiving the Universe. To them killing us was just a way of shaking hands, when two hives meet. Whereas we could not possibly see ourselves as anything less than individuals. And this is just the stuff our simple minds can even think of. Imagine what’s really out there.
Anyways, these are just my random rambling thoughts on the issue. I’d love a cliche Universe like Star Trek where you can go around meeting new races, but our evolution does not seem to fit the natural order of things, and we might very well find ourselves in a ‘Sea of Animals’ who are far more content to live simply than extend their will upon the Universe.
Hopefully we will find out in my lifetime =) But that would pretty much require some alien race to come here and give us that technology
Crop circles are completely man-made. I’ll try to scare up a link, but there’s a UK group that has been making them for over a decade – they’ve even demonstrated how they do it.
As to the UFO’s seen by pilots – one of the leading hypotheses is hallucination from the oxygen mixture in pressurized cabins/breathing gear.
”LexxLurker” wrote:Actually that didn’t come off too well, not the way I meant it anyway 😯
I wasn’t responding to you in particular, just rambling in general to the UFO’s are Flying Saucers conspiracy theory. My bad! 😳
I know someone who made a crop circle in High School. Yet the experts still brought in instruments which showed there was “unusual energy”. Uh huh.
And they remarked on the local news there was unusual odor as well, which actually came from one of the boys… erm… marking his territory with beer and urine in the middle before they left. 😆
Found it:
http://www.circlemakers.org/guide.html
A straightforward guide to making your own crop circles!
The thing i find really funny about the whole ufo/alien debate is the amount of people, who when completely dissmissing the prospect of their existence and the possibility that they may be visiting Earth, who turn round and say something like “well, what makes you think that we’re that important that aliens would even want to visit us?”. maybe it’s just me, but that seems a very arrogant statement in itself- like people are thinking we are really that important even if they are actually physically saying the opposite. like saying if aliens are actually visiting, we must be something really special “wow! aren’t humans cool!”
my response to those people is usually just 2 words. “LAB RATS”. scary thought, isn’t it?I don’t think that’s arrogant. I truly believe we (as a planet, not as a race of humans) don’t have anything useful to offer a spacefaring race. If there are other life forms out there (which there must be) and if they are space or dimension travelers (maybe, maybe not), compared to other planets and bodies in this solar system, the Earth isn’t the best choice for exploration. It doesn’t have anything to do with having humans on it or not. With or without us Earth doesn’t have much to offer.
There are other planets which are richer in base elements than our planet, and which aren’t (that we know of) infested with critters that would need to be exterminated. The asteroid belt would be easier to mine and it would be more efficient to get water from a comet or from H and O than the surface of a planet with an atmosphere (assuming they needed any).
But, in my view a spacefaring race stepping into this solar system would be more interested in keeping their technology going and gathering information on natural resources. Unfortunately that view is based on human history sending out explorers to find new resources, then followed by merchants, then pirates, then by scientists studying the local lab rats once the piracy is quashed and the shipping lanes are safe.
There’s no way to know how alien history and psychology might be different, but that’s my only logical point of reference so that’s what I go with. They could just as easily send the scientists in first to study the lab rats, either as a food source or to check for disease, but it seems more logical to me (keeping in mind my only point of reference is that of a non-spacefaring creature 😉 ) they would just mine around us and freak us out terribly before showing any interest in us as biological specimens.
pet wrote:Personally, I think it’s haughty to believe Earth has the only life in creation, or that carbon-based life is the only possible kind, but I don’t believe for a minute we have any flying saucers (or equivalent) visiting us. Wouldn’t they have better things to do than come down here and do donuts in a cornfield?
PetWhat is an “alien” life-form?
to be honest, i can’t think of anything this pitiful little rock would have to offer an alien race, either. it maybe just they do what they do simply because they can. after all, are we the same in some respects? have not scientists just gone ahead and experimented just for the sake of curiosity, and not necessarily reasonable curiousity? we probably have as kids, all taken stuff apart, just for the sake of nothing else but the need to know what was inside. maybe this is the same thing. all i was saying about the arrogance thing was that some people seem to assume that the only reason aliens would visit us is that we would something spectacular to offer them, and that we would be equals. i’m suggesting that aliens could visit for completely opposite reasons.
right, i hope that makes sense…..i’ll stop sniffing wine gums now and go and have a lie down…… 🙂 please let me know if this post looks like gibberish!!!”snooklepie” wrote:we probably have as kids, all taken stuff apart, just for the sake of nothing else but the need to know what was inside. maybe this is the same thing. all i was saying about the arrogance thing was that some people seem to assume that the only reason aliens would visit us is that we would something spectacular to offer them, and that we would be equals. i’m suggesting that aliens could visit for completely opposite reasons.
Ah! I gotcha now. We’re kind of on the same wavelength as to human insignificance. 😉
I probably can’t envision coming here as an alien life form to investigate the critters because I wasn’t the type of kid who liked to take things apart. There were books for that if you really wanted to know, and I had seen my mother’s rage when my brother took apart our record player.
I was more of the “looking for cool stones and clay and building forts” type. I guess that would explain my focus on natural resources first. How bizarre! 🙂
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i’m just glad i made some sense, trying to figure out what to say whilst fighting through the sleepy fog!!! 🙂
i wonder what they think about the mess we’ve got ourselves in…..
i just hope i get to see the truth out there in my lifetime. it would be great to turn round to all the people who have labelled those of us that believe in the existence of intelligent alien life as freaks, give them the finger, and say “told you so!!!”…
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