Who or What is Ripper?
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OK, Buffy related questions don’t really belong on a cult sci-fi board, so sorry for that, but there is a mystery that has bugged me for sometime… Who or what is Giles?
Just watching the pathetic BBC playing catch up on Buffy on it’s second channel, it was the season finale against Glory and her minions, and there was the scene where Buffy had kicked 10 shades out of Glorificus and she was on the deck bleeding and she turned into Ben, Buffy couldn’t kill him, so when Buffy when off save sis, along comes Giles and coldly puts his hand over Ben’s mouth and nose and kills him, saying Buffy’s a hero and she’s not you and me, which seemed to me to say ‘Evil’.
Ok get to the point I hear you say, well this might appear obvious and you might well say ‘DAH’ we knew this, but I think Giles is actually Jack the Ripper atoning for his crimes.
I think Giles is supernatural in some way, and like Vampires can live a long life, although I’m not sure if he has any special powers, there was one scene where he captured a Glory minion who was refusing to talk, Giles asked Willow and Anya to get something from the shop counter, whilst their back was turned you hear a small noise, when they turned around, the minion had a look of fear on his face and was ready to fess up.
And Tera when she was catatonic, turned to Giles, and only Giles and called him ‘killer’, but no one in the scooby gang gave it a second thought.
The ever crap BBC is doing something right for a change, as they are making a show called ‘Ripper’ with Joss Whedon, so hopefully we get some insight as to what he might be.
So I think Jack the Ripper, but if not him, then who or what is he…any ideas???
SquishyIf he’s not Jack the Ripper, then he’d be a sort of demon (with really weird habits for a demon) stuck in human shape. Polite, sometimes evil bookworm demon!!!! [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]
quote:
Originally posted by Squishy:
OK, Buffy related questions don’t really belong on a cult sci-fi board, so sorry for that, but there is a mystery that has bugged me for sometime… Who or what is Giles?
Just watching the pathetic BBC playing catch up on Buffy on it’s second channel, it was the season finale against Glory and her minions, and there was the scene where Buffy had kicked 10 shades out of Glorificus and she was on the deck bleeding and she turned into Ben, Buffy couldn’t kill him, so when Buffy when off save sis, along comes Giles and coldly puts his hand over Ben’s mouth and nose and kills him, saying Buffy’s a hero and she’s not you and me, which seemed to me to say ‘Evil’.
Ok get to the point I hear you say, well this might appear obvious and you might well say ‘DAH’ we knew this, but I think Giles is actually Jack the Ripper atoning for his crimes.
I don’t think it’s anything as involved as all that. It’s been suggested, either blatantly or though hints, that Giles has had quite the checkered past. He was close friends with Ethan Rayne, the mage who’s made their lives difficult from time to time (he also turned Giles into a demon, something he wasn’t too pleased to have happened, so I think we can rule out his being a demon in human form), and who was part of a “coven” of sorts with Giles that was heavily into the dark arts. When he tells Ben that Buffy spared his life because she’s a hero, “not like us,” he means that he’s *not* a hero, and that he’s *not* above taking Ben’s life for what he’s done. What Giles is hiding is a past as a bit of a bad-ass. If he were a demon, or a supernatural being trying to atone for his sins, the Watchers’ Council would have noticed long ago, and would never have allowed him to be part of it (Faith’s first Watcher was kicked out just for being psychotic…she wasn’t even *supernatural*). The close relationship Giles had with the Council in the first few seasons would have been impossible if he were anything but human.
At any rate, I think his attempt to be the upright, bookish type is simply a means of trying to distance himself from an unsavory past that he had *as a human*. Everything in the series points to this.
–Aleck
Yep, good point about the council, something I stupidly overlooked, it can’t be that he’s a clever enough demon or bad guy to fool a council that’s been around thousands of years, and to say otherwise would be a continuity error.
Although, to scare one of Glory’s minions takes some doing, seeing as usually it’s just Glory that scares the bejeezus out of them. To do that in a split second suggests he has some hidden power, maybe that over the years he has picked up enough about the mystical to know a few tricks.
The ‘buffy is not like us’ remark is open to debate though, it could mean anything, from him being a person who has no qualms of killing to him being like Ben, i.e having a monster inside.
And when Tera got done over by Glory, her ability to see things in their true light almost gave the game away for Giles, you could see for one fleeting moment that he was concerned about her referring to him as ‘Killer’.
But why ‘Ripper’?, ok, just could be a nickname and nothing more.
But the Ripper referring to Jack the Ripper is a romantic view on my part, would be an interesting storyline.
He has managed to pull the wool over the eyes over the Scooby gang for so long, could it be that he’d pulled it off with the council?
There has been other times where he has managed to scare the bad guy, but it could be just that he knows how to do it effectively.
So, I think you’re right, he has something to hide, but it’s probably a case of him making some grave mistakes when he was younger, possibly dabbling in dark magicks resulting in the death of someone, might be why he’s not totally ok with Willow messing around with it, he’s been there himself.
Squishy[ 17-03-2002: Message edited by: Squishy ]
quote:
Originally posted by Squishy:
But why ‘Ripper’?, ok, just could be a nickname and nothing more.
Rupert = Ripper. Just a semi-clever riff on his first name. At least that’s what I’ve taken it as. I think it’s possible that as a lad, Giles took down a demon or two, and Ethan (who is the only guy I can think of that’s called him this) started using this as a nickname for him. Meaning he’s not a guy you’d want to mess with.
–Aleck
quote:
Originally posted by Aleck:
Rupert = Ripper. Just a semi-clever riff on his first name. At least that’s what I’ve taken it as. I think it’s possible that as a lad, Giles took down a demon or two, and Ethan (who is the only guy I can think of that’s called him this) started using this as a nickname for him. Meaning he’s not a guy you’d want to mess with.
–Aleck
Damn you for having the answer to everything!!!…ok, smartypants, what’s the meaning of life?
Squishy
quote:
Originally posted by Squishy:
Damn you for having the answer to everything!!!…ok, smartypants, what’s the meaning of life?
Life (n) — The opposite of death.
–Aleck
[img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] yep you got it Aleck. Ripper is a nickname Giles had when he was much younger. they don’t tell how old he was during this rebellious period he went through, just that he was young (i’m guessing early twenties). he and his coven did dabble in the dark Magicks and they worshipped a chaos demon. the reason for his rebellion was because of the Watchers council. the honor of being in the Watchers Council is passed down through the generations in a family. his father and grandfather were watchers and expected him to do the same.
Giles is human. he is just very good at what he does, being a watcher. and about killing Ben/Glory, that was necessary. Glory would have come after the rest of the scooby gang if he hadn’t killed her/him. hey, she was a hellgod that is what they do, evil! [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]quote:
Originally posted by Squishy:
[i]re: Aleck[/i]
Damn you for having the answer to everything!!!…ok, smartypants, what’s the meaning of life?
I know, I know!!! Let me say!!!
It’s 42!!!
Oh… no, that’s the answer isn’t it…. erm… what’s the question again?
quote:
Originally posted by SadGeezer:
I know, I know!!! Let me say!!!
It’s 42!!!
Oh… no, that’s the answer isn’t it…. erm… what’s the question again?
Ok, maybe we won’t get an answer to that one, but let me ask you this…how come the founder of the board is member no 3?, whose 1 & 2…God and Jesus!?!
Squishy [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_razz.gif[/img]I dont realy know mutch of most of the things you guys said! They have only showed series 1 and 2 in sweden! Series 3 comes before X-mas this year! (Half of it, anyway)
They waith ½ year before showing the 2:d half of the series and then 1 year before showing the next series! That is SOOOO damn anoying!
But Ill talk anyway!When I saw that Giles had a dark secret I was so exited to learn it! When they showed the part when you find out about his yunger days I was disapointed! I expected something darker! But frankly I think there is more to the story!
Ethan said that Buffy and the rest didnt know what Giles realy was! That sounds to me like something darker! I cant get the fealing of that he WAS the Ripper! I mean Jack the Ripper!
What about the Cuncil you say? Well they didnt kick him out when he created that Demon and got a friend killed! What says that they didnt deside that Giles should pay for his crime as a watcher or something! Maybe hes got a longer life then usaly people, I mean arent there something about watchers having longer lifes then normal people? Maybe he had a demon in himself (Or did it for some other reson) and killed as Jack the Ripper, then he got ridd of the demon and wandered around, found out about the watcher thing and became Ripper the Biker or something! Mybe some of the evil is still left! Or maybe he was just evil himself somehow! He could be paying it!
Well thats what I think anyway!
Theres to much darkness in him! Like how he kicked Ethan when he was lying on the ground! The Ben thing that you talked about and scaring the tuffest badguy! The Killer part to! And the fact that hes one of not manny people that has survived battles with Vampires!
Is he Evil with and Evil agenda? Probobly not?
But he doe has darkness in him and maybe some Evil to! Maybe he se Buffy as his salvasion, I dont know!Oh and about Xander! He was once told that he would gard/watch a prissner/peron!
I thought that maybe he would become a watcher but that thought whent to Willow!
But I wonder what the future has in store for Xander!
Maybe it had bin showed in a episode I havent seen yet but I still think hell be garding something! What doe you think?Crusader, like you I still have a gut instinct about Giles, whatever secret he is carrying around makes him one of the more interesting characters in the show.
It’s obvious that his beginnings has a lowly school librarian was designed to keep a low profile, and I think that goes beyond keeping an eye on Buffy.
Could it be that the demon he unleashed when he was younger was a demon inside of him, maybe he has managed to subdue that demon, and aside from letting it loose before he has managed to bottle it, only allowing some part of it to surface when the need arises.
Maybe Ethan knew his secret but was so scared of Giles and what he might do to him that he had decided to keep it secret.
Could well be that he is Jack the Ripper, but Giles himself is only host to an entity.
As for Xander, nothing much does happen to him, he meets someone who will change his life, but aside from that he only plays a bit part.
Squishy [img]images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_razz.gif[/img][img]images/smiles/icon_mad.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_mad.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_mad.gif[/img] NO! NO! NO! GILES IS NOT A DEMON AND THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT HE’S JACK, THE RIPPER!!
Ok, kids hunker down. It’s story time!
Giles is human. He was a watcher but he did not want to be a watcher. He wanted to be either a fighter pilot or a grocer but traditon stated that he must become a watcher, like his father and grandfather before him.
So he began to study and when he reached his early twenties he became so incredible bored with research this and chronicle that that he decided to rebel. He joined a group of rouge black magic dabbling Heavy Metal groupies including his pals Philip, Henry, Deirdre Page, and everybody’s favorite chaos worshipper, Ethan Rayne. Together they cause lots of mischief, performed dark spells, sex, demons, and rock n roll, that sort of thing. But one day they summonned a chaos demon named Eyghon, the Sleepwalker. Eyghon was a chaos demon that could possess the bodies of dead or sleeping host. One of them would sleep while the rest would summon Eyghon. He would possess them and they would get some sort of rush off of it. The problem is if Eyghon stays within a host for to long he begins to manifest physically, transforming the person body to resemble his true form. One day Eyghon stayed inside Thomas Sutcliffe to long and the demon started reeking havok. Giles and friends managed to exorcise him but only at the cost of Thomas’ life. Ashamed that his actions had caused the death of his friend he returned vigorously to his studies and went on to become a watcher. THE DEMON IS NO LONGER IN HIM. WHEN IT RETURNED TO TAKE HIS LIFE IN “THE DARK AGE” IT WAS DESTROYED WHEN IT TRIED TO ENTER ANGEL’S BODY(demon,soul, its a little crowded in there.) Giles is not evil his just done bad things and he’s had to make hard decisions in life, make choices “that no one should have to make.” He killed Ben because he had to. The only darkness that is in him is the fact that he has killed before and if need be he will kill again, especially if someone is messing with Buffy, who is like the daughter he never had.
HE IS NOT JACK THE RIPPER. As Aleck stated before Ripper is a snazzy way of saying Rupert. It is, however, an allusion to Jack-the-Ripper. Ethan calls him this because like Jack the Ripper, Giles is a badass and was a very dangerous young man in his youth.
You guys don’t have to worry about Giles going all evil on everybody, he’s not going to do that. He’s a good person who every now and then has to be viscious but he does it to save every body else.
SPOILER (DO NOT READ THIS IF YOU HAVE NOT SEE THE SIXTH SEASON)
After Buffy’s death while fighting Glory, Giles had no longer any reason to stay in Sunnydale. He no longer had a Slayer to watch and the grief was just to much for him.
Giles left for England only to return when he had received word that Buffy had been resurrected. He left again after a few episodes when he realized that Buffy will never be able to become self sufficient if Giles is still around “playing the father” as he says during the musical. The point is if there is anymore dirty little secrets that Ripper has not told us about we are not going to hear about because he’s left the show.
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