bonnee
Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
[quote=”pet”][quote=”bonnee”]
(But if it still makes you uncomfortable, I have no problem removing it. I’m not into the troll thang. )
Pet;D[/quote]
Well, I’m certainly into the troll thang 😆 and would encourage you to keep it up. I knew it was possible for almost anyone to know these things – I once encountered a random pop up informing me of the same details, and then it attempted to sell my privacy software for my own protection 🙄 Its just that this is the first time I’ve seen ‘detection’ embedded in an internet post, and assumed that what it was detecting was surfer specific. The fright I got was more ‘wow, look how easy and commonplace’ it now is for our identity to be tracked, etc.
Sorry Pet – didn’t mean to cast aspersions on you at all. The only concern I have is not giving someone else the frightful reminder first. 😀
an unrelated concern, of course, is how contentious censorship posts can somehow mysteriously disappear off the face of the earth – I can only assume that the Village (idiots) might have sent a big bouncing ball after it.
The fact that Pet’s internet posts can somehow detect (and advertise) my isp address, location , operating system, and browser freaks me out. 🙁
my left
buttock
itches…and twitchesmy right toe
toes the linesci-fi aint dead
it is merely
feasing
on
the
carcus
of watermelon pips(copwrite: bonnee – the people’s poet)
[quote=”Flamegrape”]Best looking fan-Kai I’ve ever seen, that’s for sure.
😆 😆 :lol:[/quote]I don’t know – it looks as if he might take himself too seriously. 😛
Logan, my partner is a South African Jew, and conforms to the ‘Ayran’ ideal (long blonde hair, blue eyes, milk white skin, etc). As I’ve indicated previously, I’m an Arab (long black hair, brown eyes, dark skin, etc). My partner’s family is fond of commenting that I look more Jewish than they do (whatever that means). At any rate, I didn’t realise I was rascist until my daughter was born – my heart ‘instinctively’ sank when she initially looked like me (apart from the BIG blue eyes, she was very Asiatic looking). I suppose I was unconsciously hoping that she would be Ayran looking – or at least, would look more like her mother than her dad.
Intriguinly, now that she’s growning, her skin and hair have lightened considerably, and she’s developed pronounced curls down the back of her long hair. And as someone at her cresche commented yesterday (another jew, Asiatic looking): she is the ‘ideal child. Every family wants a beautiful little goldilocks – your so lucky, etc’ . I suppose what I’m saying (and hearing) is that the Aryan ideal is ingrained in one form or another, and can surface in quite unexpected ways.
If you like Vons Trier, you might want to check out the films of Raul Ruiz (assuming you haven’t Logan, which you probably have 😳 )
Anyhow, its often suggested within film cirlces that Trier has made a career out of ripping off this (generally) unknown Chillean filmmaker now residing in France. When Zentropa was first released, for example, all the celebrated visual flourishes were cited as Ruiz innovations and Triers so called weirdness felt second hand (see his Dark At Noon, Shattered Image, Life is A Dream, Golden Boat, Three Lives and Only One Death). He seems to have gone a little ‘legit’ of late – he recently did a ‘respectable’ version of one of Proust’s books (Time Regained), although I recall a Guardian interview where (in promoting TR) he jokingly goes so far as to claim to have made the first Dogme film as well. 🙄
Actually, just found the interview (google is a marvel) [url=http://film.guardian.co.uk/Feature_Story/interview/0,5365,119518,00.html]HERE[/url]
I also recall reading in Sight and Sound (relatively) recently an article on the Wicker Man, coinciding with its dvd release. From memory, the dvd version is completely restored and includes scenes deleted from the original because of their ‘perversity’ and ‘weirdness’. should be right up your alley, then. 😆
The best music magazine, IMAO, is Britian’s Uncut. Its actually a bit of a trojan in that the cover often suggests a conservative or nostalgaic look at music – Neil Young is on the current cover in my hands, Fleetwood Mac were on the previous issue’s cover – although it is always pushing more progressive an/or contemprary artists on the inside.
It’s trojan like approach seems to be working to – it was recently awarded the the PPA’s Consumer Specialist Magazine of the Year and International Consumer Magazine of the Year as well as continues to experience annual sales growth. Ironically, I never even wanted to look at it, even though it would come into my parent’s newsagency and I could’ve read it for free. The covers always deterred me, but one bored morning I decided to peek at their album of the month, and it was a progessive electronic act – the following month, alt.county, the next month, underground hip hop…
To cut a long story short – if you see it on the newstands, don’t make the same mistake I did. 😳
[quote=”Logan”][i]The Wicker Man and The Kingdom Put the Occult in Cult Cinema[/i]
I couldn’t resist responding to this old topic. The Wicker Man is a favourite cult classic of mine.
When I was about 12 my friend had a book on cult films, and I tried my best to see all of them – The Wicker Man was one of the best. Subsequently, I’ve found my taste is almost invariably “cult,” and arthouse. It’s not that mainstream acceptance puts me off a film (and many foreign arthouse films are mainstream in their country of origin), it’s just that my tastes are uncommon.
As a consummate “outsider,” and I would like to think a free-thinker, I have always been sympathetic to stories of alienation and displacement (mind you, I was no fan of “Alien Nation” ;); alienation is an incredibly common theme of course). So, not surprisingly the fish out of water story of a devout Christian (not a liberal thinker) stranded in an island of heathens would appeal to me – although unlike him, I would have definitely had far more fun on the Island. Yes indeed, I would have taken advantage of the situation. When in Rome… 😉 But their erotic village is not all fun and games; very sinister — human sacrifice of virgins, and whatnot. I won’t give away too much, but I’ll tell you that Woodward’s puritanical character is a virgin. Burn, baby burn!
Christopher Lee is excellent, as is Edward Woodward (was anyone else here a regular watcher of the Equalizer?) If you consider yourself to be a cult buff, then this is a must see.
Here’s a review of [url=http://www.stomptokyo.com/movies/wicker-man.html]The Wicker Man[/url]
BTW, there has been much talk of a Hollywood remake of The Wicker Man starring Nicholas Cage and directed by famed “indie” director Neil LaBute (I really enjoyed his In the Company of Men) If the remake gets made it will be very different. Expectedly, rather than taking place on a pagan island off the coast of the UK, it will be set in the US – frankly, I don’t necessarily see this a bad thing, Hollywood has quite the reputation for being a city of pagans and strange cults. Far be it for a Hollywood film to be quite so critical of Hollywood (there are exceptions), and such a choice of location would tend towards farce anyway. Nope, in the proposed remake Cage will find himself in a community of women descended from the pilgrims. More sex and violence is promised in the remake, so they’re obviously naughty descendants of pilgrims. BTW, anyone see Ken Russel’s The Devils?
On to The Kingdom and [url=http://www.geocities.com/lars_von_trier2000/]Lars von Trier[/url]: I agree that it was rather forced, but von Trier is one of my absolute favourite directors around (right up there with Kieslowski, Zhang Yimou and Shohei Immamura). I actively seek out his films. Not only were Breaking the Waves and Dancer in the Dark absolutely superb, but I loved Zentropa and Element of Crime – essential cinema.
Also von Trier is famed for being on of the founders of Dogma 95. Many directors signed on to it including Harmony Korine (although he has not made a true Dogma film). Many people took it very seriously, and there are some interesting and good ideas in the manifesto, but I find it all rather amusing. I’m sure they must have been rather tongue-in-cheek when coming up with it: Check out the official [url=http://www.dogme95.dk/]Dogme 95 website[/url] — I love that pic of the pig! 😀
If you haven’t yet seen any von Trier films, here’s the trailer for [url=http://moviefilmfest.com/800/dancerinthedark.htm]Dancer in the Dark[/url]
Now it’s time for my choice of weird film, just about anything [url=http://www.petergreenaway.com/]Peter Greenaway.[/url] I can’t say I like all his stuff – they often have a voyeuristic quality and an abundance of nudity (mostly male nudity) that makes me uncomfortable. And The Cook , the Thief, His Wife, and her Lover, which I thought very good, is very disturbing at times. A lot of disturbing scenes in his movies; in A Zed and Two Naughts the pictures of decay… (okay, I won’t get into the more disturbing details from the film, enjoyed it ‘though). His composition is unique, and he has a rather bizarre sense of humour, I really don’t think I’ve seen any other films like his; he’s an original. This is not his weirdest (I thought it his most accessible – most require real patience, not for the ADD generation) but it’s still plenty unusual, and it’s the one that made me a true fan of his: Drowning By Numbers.
Also, to get more sci-fi, I might add almost anything Cronenberg. Dead Ringers was my favourite of his, Videodrome was amongst his weirdest (his films are often plenty disturbing).[/quote]
Shouldn’t you be wiping a baby’s bottom? 😛
Unfortunately they’ve been pushing shit uphill for a long time now, and this toilet rag has been going downhill ever since. 😥
Its all about lifestyle now – then again, maybe it always was. Jugding by the smell, the times are just changing and its a new answer thats blowing in the wind.
I also like (love) Samurai Jack, although we’ve only seen the first series in Australia..new episodes in August though! Malcolm in the Middle, Larry Sanders and The Sopranos remain current faves, and I’ll continue to watch Homicide: Life On the Street reruns up until they put a toe tag on me…
I watch other shows of course, but more out of interest or obligation rather than committment or preference.
If and when you both manage to see Lost Highway, please share your thoughts. As for mine, I remember hating it once watching it, and needed to watch something else just to rid myself of the experience. I remember enjoying the other movie much more, but for the life of me can’t remember what is was.
But I couldn’t get Lost Highway out of my head, and found myself wanting to watch it again (and again) a week later in a (failed) bid to put me out my misery. 🙁 It has a hypnotic effect on you, much like watching reflected white lines on road pass beneath you at night. Bloody hell – I think I need to watch this piece of crap again 😳 😛 🙄
Mulholland Drive is great, but sometimes I wonder if Lynch is willfully obscure because he really has nothing to say other than (cough) ‘all is illusion’. The interesting thing about MD though is that it was originally made as a television pilot, and was rejected for being too Lynchian 😯 So what we see is a remarkably impressive salvaging project of an originally proposed tangential 13 part tv series. MD ends up being Lynch’s version of Sunset Boulevard, and resembles a career overview of his own Hollywood career (tropes, themes, motifs, etc). It comes a little close to being self parody if it wasnt so stark and dark.
Logan, given you’re predilection for road movies, you should check out Lost Highway if you haven’t done so already. Mulholland Drive reprises Lost Highway’s tone and approach, not to mention pivotal ‘twist’ in the road. It could even be argued that Mulholland Drive is Lost Highway lite insofar as it makes many more concessions to the audience and is much more frightening/confusing.
the reason australia is the sci -fi capital of the world is – apart from the world standard of our technicians – that we’re dirt cheap! You get more gang bang for your buck. The exchange rate virtually makes us a thirld world nation – I’m surprised that Nike is yet to find its way downunder.
[quote=”Logan”]
BTW, I can’t wait for the movie![/quote]
I’m surpised you haven’t shared your thoughts about the new Matrix yet. Haven’t seen it? Don’t think its worth commenting on?
The thing I love about the film is the way it introduces age old questions and themes into the new age mainstream – as evident by all the talk trying to determine what’s real or not, etc across the Internet. For someone like me – and presumably you – the onus is also upon us trying to keep up with the computer program/mer variation of ‘reality’.
Another not so crytic reference to SMG, this time from Salon. Apparently she’s ‘special’.
(they have two major articles on the show this week)
This last season has been about that, taking the idea of how the
Slayer is different from other people and really exploring it. The last
episode is in fact about that very issue. Part of that has to do with
where we want to go with the message of the season, which is really contained in the last episode, deal with the idea of separateness. And honestly, some of that comes from the actors. Ultimately there always had been some separation between the star and the ensemble. You find that bleeds into your storytelling. The way that Giles got hipper and Willow got sexier. Because that’s who [the actors] were. You live with these people and interact with them for the past seven years and that
starts to creep in. The whole “I’m a stalwart hero who does the job” sort of came from Sarah [Michelle Gellar] a bit.It also came from “I’ve come back from the dead!” This is no small
thing, no coming out of the shower. You don’t buy that back cheaply. Whereas last year Buffy went to a place of dark questioning, which is very much not Sarah, this year was about “OK, I have this power that sort of separates me from the rest of the world,” which in a weird way is the life of a star.i’m not sure how credible the source is – an ‘insider’ provides the inside gossip – but
[url=http://www.women.com/entertain/gossip/articles/0,12718,270114_579140,00.html]Article from women.com[/url]
word of warning – if you don’t want to know how buffy ends, skip the first paragraph.
[quote=”Flamegrape”]
Roger Ebert, of the Chicago Sun-Times, noticed it: “We may also wonder if Zion and its free citizens really exist, or if the humans only think so, but that leads to a logical loop ending in madness.”[/quote]
Well, I (and any other person vaguely familar with philosophy) would question the latter part of where that ‘logical loop’ might lead. Within Descartes, the cogito – I think, therfore I am – is offered as a proof of existence. Ghost in the Shell (like the Matrix) turns that thought on its head, and encourages us to think about what it means to be sane or rational (ie. self conscious, or trully real). The Matrix is a religious allegory about the meaning of life itself.
Actually, you asked a couple of questions which were (themselves) clearly mere copies seeking an original (copy). 😆 In my attempt to retrace them, I see simulations and simulcara of an original question that (somehow) got lost in the hall of mirrors seeking an identity and/or object of comparrison . In other words, get with the programme 🙄
The answer/s to your questions (I think) can be traced back to the first film, where Neo opens a copy of Baudrillard’s Simulacra and Simulation . Baudrillard’s ideas provide a key to understanding the The Matrix (the film and the program) . In Baudrillard, a simulacra is a copy without an original, and I suspect that this equally applies to the Matrix and/or its inhabitants….who are in search of an original (copy) within the matrix. In other words, they are all living life in a simulacra, a copy which is its own ‘true’ reality, (who in turn) are looking for the truth of who/what they might be in there. Given the filmmaker’s liking of anime, I also think that Ghost in the Shell provides the best way to unlock the significance of a simulacra – where the artificially intelligent beings strive to become conscious of the limits of their own virtual reality.
[quote=”Logan”]
Do you mean that classic of Australian cinema [i]Root 69[/i]? (Aussies will get the pathetic little joke).
[/quote]
😳
Two Lane Blacktop and Kings of the Road. 8)
[quote=”SadGeezer”]So, [b]do you agree Bonnee?[/b]
[/quote]
I think its a matter of public record that I have no opinions of my own. 😛
I thought it was a real stinker. It gave me abdominal cramps, the runs and I had to open every window in the house thereafter. The neighbours called the police about the stench too. The gardens within the surrounding environment are now pushing up the daisies.
High praise indeed.
[quote=”SadGeezer”]
I’d buy a console if I could get a game as good as Elite or X Beyand!
Is Metroid Prime anything like them?[/quote]
Metroid Prime is incomparable, and warrants investigation with respect to itself. I’m not sure you’d want to buy a console just to play the one game though. You could always be a complete loser like me and own all three. Given the fact that your already a moral reprobate like moi (pardon my french letters), I would recommend the PS2 just to play Grand Theft Auto 3 and Grand Theft Auto: Vice City. Not sci fi related in any way, but the vicarious and visceral thrills are second to none. These games have become the standard to measure the decline of Western civilisation, and offer hours upon hours of reckless fun, wanton abandon and destruction.
Still, this is a Metroid Prime thread so allow me to reiterate: beg, borrow or steal this game now if you think your a discerning game player and/or avid sci fan. Life is to too short to watch generic sci-fi in the vain hope that something worthwhile might appear and remind us of why we watch it the first place. At least this way, you get to be the character in a fully immersive and interactive sci-fi environment
[quote=”isola”]
tell me more about it, because it might be time for me to buy a new game… it just might.. :wink:[/quote]
Isola, what can I tell you other than its Must See Tv! You get to play an astronaut visiting a planet that reveals many hidden depths, creatures and secrets. Unlike the initial Metroids, it’s in a 3D environment (generally) explored from a first person perspective . You also can morf into a electronic ball in order to explore various catacombs, etc . Despite being armed to the teeth, Metroid is not primarilly a first person shooter though : Halo it aint. The intensity of the experience is derived from a sense of exploration, discovery, and encounters , and the way the astronaut literally internalises the extraterritorial environment. I provide an overview of reviews from metacritic – it currently enjoys a near perfect rating from across a range of sources.
http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/gamecube/metroidprime/
Once you finish it, then go out and buy Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker . Another marvel to behold , and certainly preferable to passively watching crap on tv. 😉
Lexxlurker, I would strongly suggest you explore the possibility of getting a gamecube just to play Metroid Prime and Wind Waker – especially if you can get the latter bundled with the purchase of a console going for cheap. At any rate, Metroid Prime will bring back many memories – much of the joy can be derived from a sense of recognition and wonder in its new found glory.
Really? Whilst the PS2 is hands down the most popular console in the world (only sometimes for good reason, like Vice City, Ico and Rez), my understanding is that the X-box and Gamecube are competing for second place in most markets.
.And the general consensus is that the Gamecube is struggling to keep up with the Xbox because Nintendo can’t shake off its ‘kiddie’ reputation within the marketplace. (In England a major retailer recently stopped stocking it and in Australia they’re virtually giving it away).
http://www.gamespy.com/editorials/april03/nintendo/
Indeed, there is even talk of Nintendo going the way of Sega and becoming a game developer/publisher only (Sega’s dreamcast was fantastic and a unfair casuality of the console wars). No doubt such talk is premature, but it is an indication that it has lost considerable ground, and much of it to the X-box (apparently). In fact, Nintendo has recently been reduced to ‘giving away’ its most anticipated and prized game (Wind Waker) with GC in an attempt to kick start console sales.
http://news1.iwon.com/tech/article/id/317848|technology|04-11-2003::18:29|reuters.html
[quote=”Flamegrape”][quote=”bonnee”]I just want to take the opportunity to thank the US and the UK for cleaning up an incredibly repressive power structure, and replacing it with a very messy power vaccuum.[/quote]
This is a bad thing? I think it’s great!I’m beginning to suspect that muslims really suck at modern warfare.
[quote=”bonnee”]My very best wishes to the liberated people of Iraq – try not to steal too many vases or kill any wayward Muslims in the determination for your newfound ‘freedom’. Please remember – there will be no pork in your Big Macs , and ‘Mecca’s’ will be open for breakfast time after your daily morning prayers.[/quote]
I think it’s great. The sooner they westernize the country and set up a democracy, the better. From there, we can use Iraq, Afghanistan, and Israel as bases to take over the rest of the Middle-east. United States marines and tanks, rolling through the streets of Mecca! Yeah! That will put an end to all conflict![/quote]I think you are missing the bigger picture. The fall of Bagdad is all part of Allah’s battle plan, and an indication that the jihad involves one battle plan amongst many. It was written that the Baath party would act as a blood bath , luring the infidels to the holy land under a false pretence and sense of security. The Mid East must be colonised in order to enable the muslim right to the land – we can only rid the world of imperalists if we can invite them into our homes and strangle the sleeping dogs whilst they lie awake thinking of Lawerence of Arabia et al.
If imitation is the finest form of parody, then it would appear that the Iraqi minister has become an advisor to Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld . From one wag (or dog) to another.
The (western) media is now conveniently exaggerating reports of riots and looting , and rerunning a single image: “It’s the same picture of some person walking out of some building with a vase.”
There appear to be a lot of vassals in politics. 🙄
[quote=”Logan”]
Maybe we should all step back and try our best to argue it from both sides; both sides do have valid concerns. In fact, and again I haven’t done this much either, a well prepared argument should address both sides of the issue well… The only opinion (position claim, belief, or thesis) that should be accepted is one that you can defend with a good argument (are the premises acceptable, relevant, and sufficient to support your conclusion). Maybe we should stick to the standard form of an argument:
Since… (premise),
and… (premise)
and… (premise)
Therefore… (conclusion)It would also be a lot easier to read; less cluttered, less wordy, and easier to understand.
[/quote]
And if sadgeezers had wings, our arguments would fly. 😆
Sorry, I meant to provide an invalid argument of your valid point.
If p, then q (if pigs had wings, then they would fly).
p (pigs have wings).
therefore q (pigs can fly).
Disclaimer : please note that bonnee in no way is implying that sadgeezers are pigs – or indeed, high flyers. Just having some fun at logic’s expense. 😯
[quote=”A-DM”]I’m happy that the threat is gone and that’s all I wanted, so for me this thread is now over.
BTW, congrats to the US and the UK, too Bush and Blair and all our forces, you proved them all wrong as I knew you would…job well done.
ADM[/quote]I just want to take the opportunity to thank the US and the UK for cleaning up an incredibly repressive power structure, and replacing it with a very messy power vaccuum.
My very best wishes to the liberated people of Iraq – try not to steal too many vases or kill any wayward Muslims in the determination for your newfound ‘freedom’. Please remember – there will be no pork in your Big Macs , and ‘Mecca’s’ will be open for breakfast time after your daily morning prayers.
[quote=”Logan”]
BTW, we all read articles etc., but I appreciate it when someone takes the time to find an article that that person thinks offers useful insights. I hadn’t read either of those articles and so I appreciated the chance to read them. Also, many of us will only read articles from sources (or follow the media) which have inherent biases similar to ours (we are ALL biassed) the practise of posting articles may expose us to professional opinions that we would not otherwise be exposed to, or we would ignore. If one doesn’t want to read the articles, it is one’s choice to ignore them.
.[/quote]
Logan, to quote Neil Young – this note is for you! (Its quite funny the way Hitchens turns our critisism against us)
Giving Peace a Chance
The war critics were right—not in the way they expected.
By Christopher Hitchens
http://slate.msn.com/id/2081326/
So it turns out that all the slogans of the anti-war movement were right after all. And their demands were just. “No War on Iraq,” they said—and there wasn’t a war on Iraq. Indeed, there was barely a “war” at all. “No Blood for Oil,” they cried, and the oil wealth of Iraq has been duly rescued from attempted sabotage with scarcely a drop spilled. Of the nine oil wells set ablaze by the few desperadoes who obeyed the order, only one is still burning and the rest have been capped and doused without casualties. “Stop the War” was the call. And the “war” is indeed stopping. That’s not such a bad record. An earlier anti-war demand—”Give the Inspectors More Time”—was also very prescient and is also about to be fulfilled in exquisite detail.
So I’m glad to extend the hand of friendship to my former antagonists and to begin the long healing process. Perhaps one might start by meeting another of their demands and lifting the sanctions? Now the inspectors are well and truly in, there’s no further need for an embargo. I noticed that Kofi Annan this week announced that the Iraqi people should be the ones to decide their own government and future. I don’t mind that he never said this before: It’s enough that he says it now.
What else? Oh yes, the Arab street did finally detonate, just as the peace movement said it would. You can see the Baghdad and Basra and Karbala streets filling up like anything, just by snapping on your television. And the confrontation with Saddam Hussein did lead to a surge in terrorism, with suicide bombers and a black-shirted youth movement answering his call. As could also have been predicted, those determined to die are now dead. We were told that Baghdad would become another Stalingrad—which it has. Just as in Stalingrad in 1953, all the statues and portraits of the heroic leader have been torn down.
Some other predictions, it is true, didn’t fare so well. Saddam Hussein didn’t manage to fire any poisons into Israel (where they would also have slaughtered the Palestinians), and the Israeli government didn’t seize the chance to expel the population of the occupied territories. Nor did the Turks manage to annex Iraqi Kurdistan. Osama Bin Laden, or one of his ghostwriters, did admittedly call for a jihad. But then, he always does that. Meanwhile, the Muslim world and its clerics seem decidedly undecided about whether or not Saddam really was a great Saladin after all. The Sunni Kurds and the Shiite slum-dwellers, who fought against Saddam and who rebelled against him the first chance they got, would appear on the face of it to have as good a claim to be Muslim as anybody else.
But these are mere quibbles. We should celebrate our common ground as well as the gorgeous mosaic of our diversity. The next mass mobilization called by International ANSWER and the stop-the-war coalition is only a few days away. I already have my calendar ringed for the date. This time, I am really going to be there. It is not a time to keep silent. Let our voices be heard. All of this has been done in my name, and I feel like bearing witness.
[quote=”Flamegrape”]bonnee, do you post news articles because you think none of us here ever watch televisioin, read newspapers, magazines or online news websites? Do you think we are all completely ignorant? That we live in a total void through which this bulletin board is our only source of information?
🙄[/quote]
Following Logan, I invoke Davidson’s principle of charity with a reminder that charity begins at home. 😉
At least one other, however, would seem to prefer the principle of parsimony (a variant of Occam’s razor) in order to cut and paste further vitriol. 🙄
Northern Lite (an excellent overview of reporting of events)
Article URL: http://g.msn.com/0NL62004/1472
edited by a generalised unpopular demand.
——————————————————————————–
Victory in the war is not victory in the argument about the war.
By Michael Kinsley
http://slate.msn.com/id/2081376/
So, we’ve won, or just about. There is no quagmire. Saddam is dead, or as good as, along with his sons. It was all fairly painless—at least for most Americans sitting at home watching it on television. Those who opposed the war look like fools. They are thoroughly discredited and, if they happen to be Democratic presidential candidates (and who isn’t these days?), they might as well withdraw and nurse their shame somewhere off the public stage. The debate over Gulf War II is as over as the war itself soon will be, and the anti’s were defeated as thoroughly as Saddam Hussein.
Right? No, not at all.
To start with an obvious point that may get buried in the confetti of the victory parade, the debate was not about whether America would win a war against Iraq if we chose to start one. No sane person doubted that the mighty United States military machine could defeat and conquer a country with a tiny fraction of its population and an even tinier fraction of its wealth—a country suffering from over a decade of economic strangulation by the rest of the world.
Oh, sure, there was a tepid public discussion of how long victory might take to achieve, in which pro’s and anti’s were represented across the spectrum of opinion. And the first law of journalistic dynamics—The Story Has To Change—inevitably produced a couple of comic days last week when the media and their rent-a-generals were peddling the Q-word. No doubt there are some unreflective peaceniks still mentally trapped in Vietnam, or grasping at any available argument, who are still talking quagmire. But the serious case against this war was never that we might actually lose it militarily.
The serious case involved questions that are still unresolved. Factual questions: Is there a connection between Iraq and the perpetrators of 9/11? Is that connection really bigger than that of all the countries we’re not invading? Does Iraq really have or almost have weapons of mass destruction that threaten the United States? Predictive questions: What will toppling Saddam ultimately cost in dollars and in lives (American, Iraqi, others)? Will the result be a stable Iraq and a blossoming of democracy in the Middle East or something less attractive? How many young Muslims and others will be turned against the United States, and what will they do about it?
Political questions: Should we be doing this despite the opposition of most of our traditional allies? Without the approval of the United Nations? Moral questions: Is it justified to make “pre-emptive” war on nations that may threaten us in the future? When do internal human rights, or the lack of them, justify a war? Is there a policy about pre-emption and human rights that we are prepared to apply consistently? Does consistency matter? Even etiquette questions: Before Bush begins trying to create a civil society in Iraq, wouldn’t it be nice if he apologized to Bill Clinton and Al Gore for all the nasty, dismissive things he said about “nation-building” in the 2000 campaign?
Some of these questions will be answered shortly, and some will be debated forever. This doesn’t mean history will never render a judgment. History’s judgment doesn’t require unanimity or total certainty. But that judgment is not in yet. Supporters of this war who are in the mood for an ideological pogrom should chill out for a while, and opponents need not fold into permanent cringe position.
Of course opponents have been on the defensive since the day the fighting started, forced to repeat the mantra that we “oppose the war but support the troops.” Critics mock this formula as psychologically implausible if not outright dishonest, but it’s not even difficult or complicated. Most of the common reasons for opposing this war get more severe as the war grows longer. Above all is the cost in human lives, especially the lives of American soldiers. (And most American war opponents share with American war supporters—with most human beings, for that matter—an instinctively greater concern for the lives of fellow nationals, however illogical or deplorable that might be.) Unlike Vietnam, where opposition barely existed until the war had been going on for several years, this is a war in which calling for a pullout short of victory would be silly. So, once the war has started, no disingenuousness is required for opponents to hope for victory, the quicker the better.
What is an honest opponent of a war supposed to do? Since even the end of this war won’t settle most of the important arguments about it, dropping all opposition at the beginning of the war would surely be more intellectually suspicious than maintaining your doubts while sincerely hoping for victory. Inevitably, more than one supporter of this war has taunted its opponents with Orwell’s famous observation in 1942 that pacifists—the few who opposed a military response to Hitler—were “objectively pro-fascist.” The suggestion is that opposing this war makes you objectively pro-Saddam. In an oddly less famous passage two years later, Orwell recanted that “objectively” formula and called it “dishonest.” Which it is.
The psychological challenge of opposing a war like this after it has started isn’t supporting the American troops, but hoping to be proven wrong. That, though, is the burden of pessimism on all subjects. As a skeptic, at the least, about Gulf War II, I do hope to be proven wrong. But it hasn’t happened yet.
——————————————————————————–
Crusade wasn’t exactly ‘cancelled’ – abandoned is perhaps a better term. Whilst TNT and Babylonian productions both wanted the show to survive, there were notorious creative differences during the production of the first series. Lots of acrimony on both sides, with both parties accusing each other of being misled as to what they both agreed to. Suffice to say, JMS wanted something ruminative with a gradual 5 year arc, TNT insisted on MORE ACTION NOW! The conflict is even present on screen (its tone is either uncertain or maddeningly variable), with JMS taking a swipe at TNT via the decision to give the cast a more sexy uniform during a late episode. Personally speaking, I thought the show was complete crap [i]and[/i] utterly fab, either during the course of an episode or from week to week. Generally, I thought the first season of Crusade showed more promise than the first season of Babylon 5, and I often preferred it at times.
There were emergency talks of other networks taking on a second season when it was apparent that the creative differences became irreconciliable differences, but it was difficult to commit anyone a year or two down the track (from memory, SCI FI or WB had already budgeted for the upcoming financial year and everyone was reluctant to commit themselves so abruptly in advance to a show whose future remained uncertain and essentially diabled by the creative strain).
[quote=”Logan”]
Well, yeah, you have to log in first before you can access those.
[/quote]😳
😳
😳
😳
😳[quote=”thefrey”]
it was like wtf??!?
.[/quote]
Is that Latin? Kindly translate 😆
btw (but also wtf) – if no one has voted in some of the polls, that might be because they’re also experiencing a ‘general error’ when trying to access the thread.
[quote=”thefrey”]Well then you need to make that three Flame, I was not enthralled with Season 4. It had several wonderful jewels in it, but overall, I felt let down from Season 3.
[/quote]
You too, thefrey? 😯
[quote] With Bonnee turning around my post the way he did, it appears that he is pro-Saddam, unfortunately all I can do is attempt to ignore people as evil and malicious as Saddam himself
for every ten people like you, there is a character like Bonnee who manipulates you and stirs your emotions, and he’ll claim to be just like you when his real agenda is not only having a hatred for Bush/Blair, but also showing support to Saddam. Most of these characters will attempt to hide this from you, and those who openly admit it like Bonnee will pretend to be your friends whilst all the while stirring your emotions to the point of sheer anger and perhaps violence… you do not live under tyranny, even though people like Bonnee would have you believe so.
[/quote]I think someone should send in the troops to liberate Squish – I mean, ADM – from the tyranny of his own preconceptions and predujices.
It never ceases to amaze me what you think you understand – you’re so convinced of the tenability of your own convictions that anyone who might disagree with you is instinctivelly labelled a bad character (or of bad character, be it stupid, lazy or cowardly, etc).
You could actually get a gig working in Sadaam’s ministry of propaganda – you ‘re so threatened by alternate viewpoints that you’ll do whatever you can to invalidate and interpret away the implications or consequences of your own superior ‘thinking’. 🙄
[quote] Until we can sort out the potential issues with the possibility of BitTorrented data being considered Infringement of Copyright, this site will be replaced by this notice.
Updates to come! [/quote]That was the message posted at the most prolific site (the first I singled out), suggesting that bittorrent’s days might be numbered – or at least, will have to be driven underground.
Hope it wasn’t because idiots like me were spreading the word in such public forums. 🙄
Massive Attack – Butterfly Caught, from 100th Window
…that way, the pub is likely to be cleared so I can play the rest of the album (and other select tracks ) lucky you’re already wearing the correct boots, fluffy bunny 😆
[quote=”fluffy bunny”]
I’m going to assume you mean this- correct me if I’m wrong…
1) We can’t just replace any government at will just because they oppose us
2) America’s doing this as a knee jerk reaction to secure it’s position as the world’s sole superpower and will quash any country that may be close to superpower status in the next few years/decades, especially one that may be opposed to them, possibly leading to another cold war.
[/quote]
More or less – I just fear for the long term stability of the region in the aftermath of an American occupation. My view is that the ‘liberation’ of the Iraqi people will be a recruitment program for pan Arabists and/or Islamics across the Middle East, playing into all sorts of fears or concerns. Iraq itself is a nation state that arose (and thrived) in such a post war context , and look how well the colonials have managed that since. Although I recognise the desire to depose this horrid man and his horrible regime, the fact that the American’s circumvented the will of the UN will have all sorts of consequences across the world. My reading of the conflict is about retaining the balance of power, and been seen to tip the scales in favor of those Western interests coinciding with regional interests. Such a foreign policy on domestic soil (or sand) will play into an already volatile situation – if not sooner, then certainly later. No doubt the Americans will be able to contain/ward off a great deal of conflict, but it seems to me that they will have shoten off their nose to spite their two faces.
[quote=”Flamegrape”]
[i]qualem blennum[/i][/quote]
Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari
[quote=”Flamegrape”]
[i]aut disce aut discede[/i][/quote]
Clamo, clamatis, omnes clamamus pro glace lactis
I agree with Flamegrape – everyone really should watch all four seasons, if only so they can agree with me. 😛 😆 😛
Not exactly ‘anime’ (although influenced by it) nor bittorrent (but might be) is Cartoon Network’s [b]Samurai Jack[/b]. I’m sure you know about it Cat, but in case you don’t – [b]Samurai Jack[/b] can be quite wonderful and currently a personal favorite.
Might fill the void left by Kiddy Grade.
To reiterate
[b]Samurai Jack[/b]
[b]Samurai Jack[/b]
[b]Samurai Jack[/b]
[b]Samurai Jack[/b]
The above post again goes to show just how those who support war will go too great lengths to avoid the issue at hand, and that is taking a very dangerous threat out of the equation, all I have seen from the post-war brigade is rhetoric and speculation, they are forever looking for ways too add more doubt to those that sit on the fence, all of this stuff doesn’t distract me, because I know it is all being used as a weapon against Saddam and Bin Laden, anything that can dredged up about past misdeeds is used, anything from confirmed pro-war journalism is used.
All of this can come to a head when this war is over, now is not the time, the war has started and will finish with the insertion of a threat we should all fear.
Whatever the reasoning you find comfortable to support war, whatever supposed logic you wish too apply in putting Bush in the same light as Saddam, you can sometimes compare this ‘current’ coalition of Bush and Blair as being dangerous as Saddam et al…
The fact is, is that no matter how hard you moan you cant just change the government s of other countries be it Iraq or Afganistain, you don’t have too respect their decisions, but you will have to live with them, so get over it, and look at the big picture…another threat to the world is about to emerge and that is not enough for me, and it shouldn’t be for you.
Thanks to elmey’s very kind intervention – and graceful persistence – I include an edited version of the article for those (like me) who can’t access it on Salon. This is an edited version (believe it or not) and longer than I intended it to be. Apologies for the length 😕
Can “Farscape” fans reinvent TV? (cont)
When the Sci Fi Channel canceled “Farscape,” angry fans launched the usual protest movement. Now they’re dreaming of a rebellion that could overthrow TV empires.
–
Early last September, thousands of fans of the science fiction television series “Farscape” logged in to a chat room maintained by the Sci Fi Channel, which distributes the series in the United States. The Jim Henson Co. actually produces the series, mainly with licensing fees paid by Sci Fi, although Henson also syndicates the show in Britain, Germany and other countries.
What began as a collective of fans bemoaning the loss of their
favorite show has become the Save “Farscape” campaign, one of the largest and most sophisticated fan campaigns in television history.Successive campaign absorb and improve upon lessons learned during previous protests. ‘Scapers have taken the best from all of them; they sent Sci Fi executives packages of crackers, in homage to the title of a favorite “Farscape” episode, “Crackers Don’t Matter.”
‘Scapers have launched their own multi-tiered campaign. Desperate to save their show soon after the announcement, fans flooded Sci Fi’s New York offices with e-mails, phone messages and letters. But initial protests have matured into a long-term effort with one specific objective: to increase the show’s ratings by marketing “Farscape” to mainstream America. In a press release
issued soon after Kemper’s announcement, Sci Fi defended its
decision to cancel the series, saying that declining ratings no longer justified the show’s expense.During another online chat in December, Kemper said that the only way to change Sci Fi’s position would be to improve the ratings for the show’s remaining episodes. Galvanized by this last shred of hope, fans have focused on recruiting new viewers to obtain the six additional “Nielsen families,” or households monitored by Nielsen Media Research, that would pull “Farscape” up to
a 2.0 in the ratings, a figure the show has not reached this season.Six more families might not sound like a lot, but it’s actually a pretty
daunting task. That’s six households out of the approximately 5,000 Nielsen families, whose identities are a closely held industry secret. And of course they must also be among the 75 million households that receive the Sci Fi Channel either on cable or by satellite dish. To achieve that end, fans have demonstrated as much creativity and resourcefulness as “Farscape’s” creators to bring attention to their struggle. Their efforts included launching a global protest rally in 26 cities in seven countries, funding and producing a 30-second commercial that has aired in 24 major Nielsen markets, and a letter-writing campaign targeting “Farscape’s” sponsors and other broadcasting
executives.By focusing on the ratings, ‘Scapers are playing by the rules of the television industry. The problem is, no one knows whether those rules even apply anymore. There is a growing sense in the broadcasting industry that the governing business model is dysfunctional. Most media executives agree that
scripted television programs (i.e., sitcoms and dramas) are too expensive to produce and don’t guarantee audiences large enough to justify higher advertising rates and cover costs. To make matters worse, media companies rely on data collected by an outmoded and flawed ratings system, which remains heavily reliant on the paper “viewing diaries” collected by Nielsen.Acknowledging the industry dissatisfaction with its system, Nielsen recently introduced its “People Meter,” a semi-Orwellian set-top device that monitors who is in the room and what they’re watching on TV. About 5,000 families currently coexist with a People Meter, and the “overnight ratings” Nielsen accumulates from them have become crucial figures that can make TV careers, or end them.
Even if ratings were collected with absolute accuracy, it might not be enough for an industry that prefers to chase after elusive demographic segments instead of cultivating advertisers eager to reach the audience that’s already watching. In “Farscape’s” case, Sci Fi wanted the show to perform better with boys. But the show has already attracted a broad audience, including large
numbers of women attracted to the show’s strong female characters, feminist storylines, and the sexual tension between human John Crichton and his alien flame, Aeryn Sun (Claudia Black).According to advertisers, women and sci fi don’t mix. These same broad demographics prompted the producers of the syndicated series “Stargate SG-1” to change the mix of characters and storylines so that show would attract more boys and young men, prompting female viewers to mount their own
protest campaign last year. Ironically, Sci Fi recently purchased broadcast rights to the retooled “Stargate SG-1” and placed it in “Farscape’s” old slot, Friday at 9 p.m., which may have contributed to Farscape’s audience erosion.Financial tensions came into play in the fall of 2002 during
negotiations over “Farscape’s” fee for its final season. Mindful of its own profit margins, Sci Fi offered an amount lower than expected, arguing that the show’s declining ratings meant lower advertising fees. “Farscape’s” producers argued that they could not make the show with a smaller budget and had no extra
funds to cover the shortfall in licensing fees. According to industry
insiders, Sci Fi then exercised a contractual provision that permitted it to opt out of its renewal agreement.The most interesting aspect of the Save “Farscape” campaign has been the willingness of the fans to address and remedy the problems of television economics in order to save their show. If scripted television is doomed, these fans may be on the forefront of a collective effort to keep high-quality dramatic serials on the airwaves for all to enjoy, not just those who can afford premium cable or video on demand.
Using a wide range of e-commerce tools, ‘Scapers have collected money for a variety of purposes. There’s the “Farscape”: Beyond Hope fund, which financially supports the advertising initiatives to promote the show and garner higher ratings. This fund has raised about $9,000 to fund press kits for the media, newspaper ads, and a traveling promotional kit distributed at sci-fi/fantasy conventions. Fan sites devoted to Ben Browder and Claudia
Black, the actors portraying “Farscape’s” lead characters, collected donations to pay for ads in USA Today, Variety and the Hollywood Reporter to gain public and media attention.Other funding drives for the show have been even more innovative. In a radio appearance last Sept. 20 on “Interstellar Transmissions,” a science fiction radio call-in show in Florida, Kemper discussed a radical idea with listeners: Could “Farscape” viewers actually find a way to finance the show themselves? Energized fans formed a task force to formalize the idea and bring
it to fruition.Matt Sampsell, a research scientist at the Fusion Research Center at the University of Texas, was so inspired that he started the “Farscape” Fund and an online “viewer financing” petition on his own, and later joined with other “Farscape” fans to form the Viewer Consortium, a nonprofit advocacy group designed to develop viewer-financed programming.
Sampsell, now managing director of the Viewer Consortium, says, “I started doing
some math in my head. “Farscape” attracts at least 2 million to 3
million people as a regular audience. Even if 1 percent of them were avid enough fans to spend $15 on mailing letters, setting up rallies, and funding advertisements, that adds up to $3 million to $4 million. And it made sense that we would be willing to spend more money for relatively direct participation in the show’s production. Writing letters is a good strategy, but you can never be sure if anyone reads them. There is no interaction.”The Viewer Consortium aims to raise more than $750,000, about what Sci Fi pays to broadcast each episode, to fund a new episode of “Farscape”
“Farscape” supporters admit it’s an ambitious goal. But they also point out that such a sum amounts to less than a dollar from each Farscape viewer in the U.S. alone, and that the consortium has already gathered some $260,000 in pledges. But fans have still greater ambitions. Staffed by about 25 volunteers all over the country who work together via telephone and the
Internet, the consortium hopes to establish a stronger voice for television viewers by converting viewer passion into financial and marketing assistance for their favorite creators and distributors.Industry observers remain skeptical. “The odds for viewer-funded financing are pretty remote,” says the author Jack Lechner. “They’d have to come up with millions” to really make an impression on producers, he argues.
On the one hand, it’s heartening to see the do-it-yourself ethic of the Internet applied to the sick-unto-death broadcasting industry. It’s also sad to reflect that no one even considers involving government agencies — like the Federal
Communications Commission or the Federal Trade Commission — that once upon a time were meant to help safeguard the rights of consumers and the public
interest in broadcasting.Unless ratings dramatically improve, this incarnation of “Farscape” will soon come to an end. Sci Fi will broadcast its last episode on March 21. The sets have been dismantled; cast and crew members have moved on to other projects. But
the television industry should beware that this is just the beginning of a new level of fan-based direct action. Once they’ve refashioned the broadcasting industry, maybe they’ll move on to politics.
